One Kiwifruit Orchardist drove all the way from Te Puke to Te Awamutu tonight so that he might stare National Party MPs Barbara Kuriger and Chris Bishop in the eye and tell them how the New Arms legislation they helped enact has not only turned him into a criminal, but also has grievously impacted on his business… affecting his ability to deal with vermin… rabbits,possums, goats, deer and many other unwanted pests that attack his crop and dig holes that endanger his workers in the field.
The National party plan to run a series of meetings around the country to discuss ongoing Gun legislation, this meeting was held at the Te Awamutu RSA, and was attended by a large mob of highly pissed off gun owners looking for blood!
I would estimate there was 300 people in attendance… filling the RSA main hall (The Mps admitted they were only expecting to use a much smaller space) and 90% of the people made it clear they felt utterly betrayed by the National party’s shameful collusion with the Labour Party coalition to rob them of their Gun rights.
From the very start many made it clear they were not interested in hearing weasel excuses, and demanded the two Mps *listen to the people*
More than one Farmer stood up and repeated they suffer same problems about pest control as the guy from Te Puke, and were outraged!
Adding the fact that not only was loosing their AR Semiautomatics a matter affecting the humane dispatching of Pests, but that it is expensive and impracticable to hire Pest control experts..who were also represented at the meeting and bitter that they too are also heavily affected by the legislation and in danger of being shut down unless by some miracle the Police find it in their hearts to grant them an exemption.
One Pest control businessman warns Banning AR semiautomatics will result in a massive increase in pest numbers.
There were Sports shooters and collectors who tore strips off these two National Party Representatives for basically destroying the things they are passionate about.
The people were not impressed with the weak excuses and outright dishonesty they received in response.
Both Kuriger and Bishop tried in vain to shift the blame onto Jacinda Ardern for how the rushed enactment of the Arms (Prohibited Firearms, Magazines, and Parts) Amendment Bill was a farcical and contemptuous violation of Due Democratic process. They told lies that they had no way of either slowing down the Juggernaut, or any power to alter the scope of the Bill … All falsehoods… none of it believed by the people present.
The Crowd was seething about the disgusting Police raids that are afoot…. guns being pointed at children,etc and after many people had expressed how incensed about how their sports, hunting and businesses were directly impacted, Ex New Zealand First candidate for Northcote Kym Koloni tore strips off them saying “Nobody gives a shit what policies you are going to take into the next election, we care what you are going to do about this Right Now!”
“Grow some Balls!, and start acting like a real opposition party or you had better make sure your CV is up to date because you will soon be out of a Job!”
She finished off by calling NZ First Leader, current deputy Prime minister Winston Peters and his sidekick, and Minister of Defense Ron Mark Traitors.
The Public Grilling lasted for over two hours.
One person quoted Jacinda Ardern Pre- Christchurch Terror attack as having stated that “It would take a Port Arthur type event in New Zealand before heavier Gun restrictions could be passed”
So Australian Brenton Tarrant provided her with the perfect opportunity to strike at New Zealanders Gun rights.
Chris Bishop was on the Committee that was supposed to have read the 12000 written submissions and herd the mere 20 people who were allowed to deliver Oral submissions, and told the crowd that though he could not disclose the Committee conversations, he said that some of the National party committee members tried to get exemptions for sports shooters yet were ‘unable to sway Labours Minister of Police Stuart Nash.
Nobody present believed they tried very hard!
The two Mps tried to hide their personal complicity in voting for the bill by saying that as it was not a conscience vote…’They had little choice’ but to vote as a block for what their Party Caurcus deemed would be the party position on the bill… to which one of the people cried out that in doing so they betrayed their local constituencies who have voted for them to take care of their communities interest … not kowtowing to their own party interests!
Chris Bishop admitted the legislation has Flaws… yet National still decided to vote for it despite this fact…. The People called that a betrayal of their duty!
One guys stood up and said instead of Banning all these Guns and having to spend a billion dollars on the buy back scheme why didn’t parliament instead legislate to shift these guns into the ‘E’ category which entails higher security gun safes, and personal vetting? to which Chris Bishop admitted that was probably a much better approach… yet offered no reason why that obviously less severe… more fair option was not considered.
That is when I got the opportunity to stand up and explain the facts.
1. These two MPs are not telling the truth as they were party to the shameful episode in the house in which Trevour Mallard and Chris Hipkins deviously took advantage of David Seymours late arrival to agree to speeding up the enactment of this legislation… the whole national party had the opportunity to slow down this process by a simple ‘No’ vote to Hipkins petition to race this bill into Law.
2. I said the reason why the lesser path of moving these arms to E cat rather than the outright prohibition was never considered *was because this was never about taking a rational approach because the Police had wanted to get these guns outlawed for years… way before the Christchurch attack… *That was the point of this Bill as far as what the Police wanted*
And I reminded them that there was a Safeguard of democracy that was being violated by the Police writing the legislation they also enforce!
Ie The principle of the Separation of Powers!
That is why The farmers got no exemptions, why the Sports shooters got no Exemptions, and why the Collectors got no exemptions!
*The Police were only interested in getting what they wanted*… to hell with everyone elses rights!
It did not matter that the people who are loosing their guns have committed no crimes.
What mattered is that the Police got what they wanted, and Ardern got what she wanted.
And the National party were fully complicit in all of it!
To Chris Bishops credit he acknowledged what I said about excessive Police power and influence in the way the amendment was framed was true.
Chris and Barbara said they were taking all this criticism on board and would report back to their party the views and feelings expressed tonight and would do their best to try and get some easement… some exemptions for Sports people, Collectors, and for pest control when ‘Round two’ of Gun legislation begins shortly.
They also mentioned round two may involve the possibility of a Gun register, of a review of what defines ‘a fit and proper person’… which is a frightening possibility that New amendments and definitions may allow the Police the discretion to deny firearms licences to anyone who expresses opinions or criticisms that neither the Police of Government appreciate… under the pretext that contrary views entail evidence that a person is not fit.
We only need to contemplate the fact that during Kiwi gun blog’s Mike Loders oral submission opposing the new arms amendments, that Judith Colins questioned if he was a fit and proper person to hold a gun licence.
One Gun collector talked about the fact that she had bought her grandson an antique lever action rifle to celebrate him getting his gun license… but now with the new Arms act ammendments his Rife … a gift from his loving grandmother …has been rendered illegal because of its tube mag capacity!
*These are the sorts of Rights violations that have been perpetrated by Ardern, and Parliament against Law abiding New Zealanders!
Its corruption!
Its a Power Grab!
More was said on both sides yet what was clear to the people present was that National party had sold them out.
I think its easy to infer the event was a bust for the National Party, who were sent home with their tails between their legs.
They have been given notice of the depth of the Peoples contempt for what they have done.
One Name however shone like a spotlight throughout the evening… Acts David Seymour!
His name would have been spoken over a dozen times and how he carried himself with courage and principle …though out this anti-gun craze… while all the rest of Parliament *Laughed* in his face and showed utter disregard for sound principles of Law, and due process.
Howls of betrayal rang out at the mention of Winston Peters and Ron Mark.
Seymour was used as an exemplar … “Why did not you two do what David Seymour did????”
I think The Act Party are looking to get a serious boost of Support from the Gun owning community of New Zealand.
The National party may think twice about rolling out these meetings across the country now they have had a taste of the wrath of the people… who wont be fooled by lame excuses for their betrayal.
Another important thing this meeting taught me is that any well organised protest down at Wellington would be well attended.
The Gun community needs to rally!
Tim Wikiriwhi
Libertarian Independent.
For New Zealand Gun Community News and Discussion go to Kiwi gun blog on Facebook here or on MeWe here
Update 14-5-19
One thing that has occurred to me with regards to one of the Police wish list for the second round of gun regulations they are lobbying for ie: for a revision of what defines ‘a fit and proper person’ to hold a Gun licence, is not only that they will seek greater discretionary powers to refuse licences to individuals on the basis of lawful comments made on Social media that they dont like… maybe criticism of the Police… maybe critisism of Government policy that the Police like… but they are also Cunningly setting up a whole avenue of excuses to absolve themselves from culpability with respect to the up and coming inquiry they are facing with respect to why they gave Brenton Tarrant a gun licence.
You see if they posit the Idea that the current definition has significant failings… they will be able to argue that they fulfilled their obligations *as the definition now stands*… and that it is *insufficient concept* of who is ‘a fit and proper person’ that is to blame and proof that the government needs to ‘make it broader’ … ie give the Police more power and grounds to refuse licences on their own discretion and judgement.
Remember the Government and Police are only interested in this process being a one way road… in their favour… more power to them, less rights … and even less people allowed to hold *any* firearms.
Do not hold any delusions about this process being fair… or reasonable… or Prudent… or has any concern for the Rights and Liberties of Lawful gun owners.
A redefinition on who is deemed to be a fit and proper person to hold a fire arms licence will also trigger a whole new wave of Police raids Raids and confiscations…
*Think about that!*
Read ‘Laughing fit’ in Parliament after David Seymour arrives too late to slow gun law reform.
NZ’s battle over semi-automatics: Police frustrated by the law, firearm owners frustrated by police
MY SUBMISSION ON THE ARMS (PROHIBITED FIREARMS, MAGAZINES, AND PARTS) AMENDMENT BILL
With the pre terror comment from Jacinda re Port Arthur and the fact that Brenton Tarrants travel to hot spot countries came to light so quickly after the terror attack that many of us questioned how he could have been overlooked as a potential terrorist. Is it possible that he was not missed, that somewhere this information was held back like some cheap budget spy movie to see how things played out? This explains why the law was pre prepared and presented as fact accompli to a shocked and floundering government. Did somebody let Brenton Tarrant play out his sick murderous fantasy with the full knowledge that innocent lives would be lost? Just how deep is our police investigation going to be? How come so much was in place waiting for Brenton Tarrants actions? Even media releases were primed to set the weight of public opinion against firearm owners. The select committee were provided with background information on submitters allowing personal attacks designed to discredit and discount testimony of those submitting against the law change. Who provided that information to them? Police? And then there is the deepest problem we have here. Police are both law enforcement and prosecution of the law the onus is not on them to find the truth or to ensure that they do indeed have got their facts correct. It is up to Joe Citizen to prove their own innocence if they have the money to do so. And now we have police actually writing the laws they are to enforce… talk about double jeopardy.
Hi Tim. Thanks for a great article that I found via a link on the Whale Oil blog website. I am sharing it far and wide on social media too.
My family originates from a farming background in Canterbury and although the past couple of generations are urban dwellers, we haven’t forgotten our rural roots.
National lost me with their pathetic response to the changes to firearms legislation, where they basically fell into lock-step with the government.
As you said in the article, only David Seymour has stood up for what is right. Last month I became a financial member of the ACT Party and I suggest other readers and the folks attending these meetings do the same, as they the only party that will represent your interests.
Given the politicisation of the Police, with door knocking, raids and weekend visits by armed police because of firearms ownership, purchases and ‘controversial’ social media posts being given as a reason, the time is now to make a stand for the 2020 election and support ACT.
Good luck with all you are doing and please remember that in spite of the garbage you read online and in the papers, urban Kiwi strongly support or rural kin – where would the country be without you.
Good on you Ken for being Politically active.
Thank you for your comment.
I have messaged David Seymour and commended him for his conduct in these matters and I have begun telling people a vote for Act is a far more principled vote than voting for any of those other established parties that have Mps in office.
I am highly suspicious that it was allowed to happen
Thanks for your comment.
I have written a reply to Irene who had similar suspicions.
Please refer to that comment for my thoughts.
cheers.
Thank you for your comment Irene.
Though we can only speculate about why things have worked out the way they have… esp if the government suppresses Tarants Court case, Intuition tells me Arderns Politics are deranged, yet her empathy for the victims was genuine… and so this would in my view make the idea that she had foreknowledge of Tarent highly unlikely… and the idea is quite repugnant to contemplate… yet still a question that may be asked.
I think there are better explanations for how she was ready to do what she did… firstly her donning a Hadjib and going down there is something by nature that she *excels at* … not only because she is a new young mother who now wants to mother the world, but also because her Politics is all about *cuddling victims*… (not to detract from her genuine concern and compassion she showed to the survivors and families of the dead.)
All this aside Christchurch terrorism was a major opportunity to display her craft ‘As State Saviour of the oppressed’, and also to implement her socialist agenda that all whacko woke Social justice warriors around the globe have immersed themselves for the last 3 decades at least and have systematically worked to see incrementally adopted as official policy throughout Western civilisation with their HQ in the UN.
The Police have wanted to Ban guns for years… at least since 911… when Police forces in the west were millitarised …
The Police today bear no resemblance to what they did Pre-war on drugs so there are two wings of government that are in agreement about the direction they want to take western society… more power to the Police and state… less rights to the people.
you are so right, there are others that too, that it see it this way, all seems a set up , ,new zealand is were most things start , ftpos , agent orange , drones ,poeple need to wake up , powers to be , will did anything , there is so much MORE , most will belive to goverment , J, o
It is far more than the ” Gun Laws ” that will bring out a pissed off crowd to any meetings that National may hold.
Hopefully this will open the eye’s of the National MP’s
Janner187
Thanks for your comment… and yes I agree.
The contemptuous way in which democracy was hustled out of the room during the Amendment debate was symptomatic of politics in NZ and other western countries. The cynical disdain that was shown to the shooting communities voice, deferring to the shriek of outrage, led to unnecessary legislation that simply could have been achieved with banning all high capacity magazines. Whether it is .22 or .308 is moot, up close the ability to inflict harm is the same. Labour, as usual, used the killings to advance its own agenda and spend tax payer dollars without a care in the world. Goodbye Ardern, goodbye National, goodbye Greens and goodbye NZ First. I sincerely hope the shooting community back David Seymour and last preference the above shysters.
Thanks for your comment and I agree those parties dont deserve our votes!
I have messaged David Seymour and commended him for his conduct in these matters and I have begun telling people a vote for Act is a far more principled vote than voting for any of those other established parties that have Mps in office.
This is all getting to be just too much of a coincidence. Take a look at this latest video from “China Uncensored” and be worried, be very worried about the direction our country is heading under this United Nations puppet masquerading as Prime Minister. Get ready and organized to vote her and her gang out of power next year.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qnNB6-osoiY
It’s just the start- police state- a lot more to come
Sadly… yes…. I think you are right… unless New Zealanders wake up, and Rally, and call for more principled Politicians who respect Freedom and the equal and inalienable rights of Individual citizens… and we get a constitution that guarantees our rights and makes it illegal for parliament to pass laws that violate our rights.
And the Police should *never* be allowed to Lobby the government to get law changes that give them more powers at the expense of our rights.. or due process.
The Police should *never be allowed to write the law… or demand the law be changed to suit their own interests… they are the servants of the people.
Good to see so many people aware of what’s happening . The people in so many countries are not being listened to by their governments , they are elected by the people for the people and don’t seem to be for the people any more . Change is needed here and in many countries . VOTE to get back to what we want and live the way we want . This is one of the best places to live in the world and our rights are being taken by our government of losing parties .
yes good as a dying
69 year old terminal ill person with lung cancer i have recently felt the wrath of jacinders jack boots handcuffed put on the ground and had the jack boot stamped in my back,,for now that is all i am going to say,,i fear for nzs future now i see on tonites news she in france saying to the world that she would shut down facebook in nz? and chinese comunist police now in auckland with our police who are chasing there tails looking for terroists who are them selves
Oh my goodness Louie… you are in my prayers.
thank you for your comment … Ardern is a stupid little girl… and a dangerous psychotic all wrapped up in one photogenic skin!
Look after yourself!
have you tried alternative treatments like cannabis Oil? (oh wait… you mentioned jackboots on your back!)
I have an alternative self help health page you could search for alternative treatments and self help,,, (below)… you must scroll down through the feed…
Respect.
Tim W
https://www.facebook.com/Self-Help-Alternative-Treatments-and-Health-497083423727076/
I was also at this meeting. The summation by Tim paints a rather different picture to the one I saw.
In my opinion the meeting was more a fiasco. Beginning with the RSA stalwart who loudly objected all evening to the RSA premises being used for such a meeting. The on/ off microphone which meant many speakers were only partially heard in much of the room.
Some comments were so stupid they were only counterproductive to genuine firearm owners needs.
The Te Puke kiwi fruit grower is a case in point. He spoke of a sprawling kiwi fruit orchard seemingly overrun by rabbits, possums, goats and deer??? And with 30 Asian employees of dubious honesty[ he said] working his orchard, he wanders around all day with his AR15 ready to shoot his pests. Saying that if he doesn’t Worksafe will come for him. Presumably because a worker might sprain his ankle in a rabbit hole. The idea of .223 bullets flying around his orchard hopefully missing his staff painted a pretty stupid picture of how to be a responsible firearm owner/user. A good fence would be a big asset to this enterprise, I suggest.
Then there was the chap who suggested semi auto owners should be like a militia to back up the army for when the Chinese invade.
Simply nuts. Hopefully no press were present. We have enough issues already.
Lets leave shooting oneself in the foot to the police.
It was obvious from the MPs present that their voting for the new laws is a decision based on the mood of the greater public. That guns are bad etc. so they don’t want to be seen as supporting gun owners due votes. It has been many years since there was a political party in NZ which had principles and stuck with them. Now it is go where the votes are at any cost.
While Bishop pledged to go in to bat for collectors and pest control type persons, to perhaps have some kind of exemption, there is no desire to support regular firearm owners. Not now, and I expect not in the future as Parliament works on the next instalment. The fear of being seen as supportive of guns in anyway will ensure the Nats will support pretty much whatever is drawn up. Don’t forget David Seymour’s issue is predominantly the abandonment of normal Parliamentry process, that’s all.
Thank you for your detailed comment Robert… it is appreciated… and I do not pretend to assume my own opinion of the night Trumps other peoples contrary views… we all see things from our own perspectives and you must appreciate the limitations on a blog post like this presenting the whole picture.
none the less i say with confidence your estimation would be far in the minority of attendees…ie would you not agree with the general truthfulness of my post with respect to the antagonistic spirit of the gun owners last night?
Certainly Tim the speakers were somewhat belligerent with their comments. If you consider that to be a measure of success for the purpose of the meeting, it will be no surprise the wider public will be only further alienated towards shooters. As was noted at the meeting, the media “lobby ” is certainly not our friend.
Do you seriously think the two MPs present will now become shooter’s advocates due to the abuse they experienced?
I cant read their minds, yet if they are genuinely surprised by how much injustice and trouble their support for the new laws have caused … and I was in their shoes … I would *definitely go back to the Party Hierarchy* and tell them that these law changes have caused serious negitive impacts… that the Police have also had too much influence in what has happened…. that the next wave of Law amendments had better grant concessions to farmers, Pest controllers, Sports shooters, etc and reduce the scale of what rifles have been banned… eg Lever actions that hold more rounds etc.
Yet will they do this?
Probably not as they are in cahoots with the agenda to take away all guns.
Good blog. Seriously, the issue that has got us all riled up is not the amendment legislation , a lot of us knew this was coming eventually, it was just precipitated by the awful events in Christchurch.
No, ‘ New Zealand’s darkest hour’ was the travesty of democracy, the unprecedented haste with which this legislation was bulldozed through parliament, and the rejection of the rights of ordinary, law abiding NZ citizens to have any input at all into a major piece of legislation. That’s what David Seymour is made about too.
I appreciate your perspective Chris.
It certainly displayed what contempt these politicians hold for the Due process.
JOINING THE CRIMINAL CLASS
Many of us use a shotgun to keep the birds off the grapes or take a rifle along on a cathartic hike in the hills after a stag when vintage is over, but the tragic events of March 15 have turned many of us into criminals. Paul Taggart takes a look at how our politicians are tragically inadequate.
My transition from relatively well adjusted middle-aged bloke to grumpy old man was fairly sudden. It happened soon after the Christchurch mosques tragedies in March.
At least this guy has something to roar about.
The events of that day were utterly appalling and, as a consequence, anything and everything the government did in the aftermath was off limits to criticism, for fear of somehow being seen as less than supportive of the bereaved.
Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern’s stocks were boosted enormously by her response, and for a few weeks it was as if we were ruled by a messiah. But opportunists were quickly at work, as such events provide fertile ground for those with agendas.
http://winenzmagazine.co.nz/2019/06/13/editorial/?fbclid=IwAR2nL0B2QO5QDSwx5fl1kG40zDYdUpA0FKuIHlDPBzoGxjFW_nRco7XgYy4